Finding A Job In A Difficult Economy With Lauren White | E05

Gary: Good morning, everyone. Welcome to The Gary Smith Show. I'm glad to have you along with us this morning. Today's show is going to be an interesting one. For the first few shows that we did, we were talking about the foundations of personal development, and then we shifted over and talked about building a godly business.

And now what we're going to do from this point forward with the show is we're going to start focusing in on various areas of personal development and business development. Today's show is called Finding a Job in a Difficult Economy.
And we've got a special guest this morning. Her name is Lauren White. Lauren is a former professional recruiter. She's a real high-energy, high-quality, professional young woman. She's also a Christian, so as you'll see, her foundational values are just incredibly solid. I've known Lauren for about a year now, and we spent some time talking about critical issues related to finding a job in a challenging economy. Today you're going to hear a number of clips from that pre-recorded conversation. Today's program is all about giving you some ideas about how to approach the process of finding a job in a challenging economy.

If you're unemployed, if you're underemployed, if you're looking for a change, or if you're considering a new career, today's program is for you. So let's jump into this thing. In the first segment of our program, we want to talk about the biggest challenges to finding a job with Lauren White. Okay, everyone.
I'm here with Lauren White. Lauren is a former recruiter and a great friend, and I really appreciate her taking the time to be with me today to do some recording relative to the whole job search process. We've got a number of topics that we're going to talk about. Lauren, thanks very much for all your help.

Lauren: Thank you for inviting me. It's great to be here, Gary.

Gary: The first topic I wanted to get on is the biggest challenges in finding a job, internal to people and external circumstances. One of the things I've hit on the radio show quite heavily the past couple of weeks is the need for personal development. A lot of that is being driven by the economy.
80 percent of households in this country are living from paycheck to paycheck. 85 percent of the people have less than $1,000 in savings. From your perspective as a recruiter, what kind of emotions have you encountered with that, and how are people dealing with that?

Lauren: When it comes to finding a job, there are internal and external challenges that come up. The internal challenges are a couple of things. First, those people that need to build up confidence see those numbers out there and are discouraged by them. My first bit of advice is don't be discouraged.
Get someone who can maybe mentor you, someone who's been through the process before, for internal challenges. A lot of jobs maybe aren't posted out there, so a good thing to do would be to talk to people and start networking. That would be one of the external challenges that's out there.

If jobs aren't posted, start seeing who you can talk to, who you can get out in the community with, and network with. Go on your LinkedIn. That's been a huge thing that's been helpful to people. I know someone I talked to recently who was looking for a job and finding challenges, struggling with it, went on their LinkedIn, met with, or shot an email out to a lot of different friends that had jobs in the community, just saying, "Hi, it's been a little while since we haven't connected.

I would love to set up the opportunity to learn about your company and what you're doing. It interests me. I'd like to get into that type of environment." Those small steps help to not only create opportunities for yourself but then help build up your confidence. So then you can get to the next level.
Go talk to those hiring managers.

Gary: Yeah. And I think the LinkedIn thing is a really powerful tool. Not only from the standpoint of what you said, but LinkedIn affords the opportunity to do targeted marketing. You can actually go in and search your list of contacts for people who are in certain businesses or various geographic locations.

Even though they may not be the owner of a company, if you just shoot them a quick email and say, "Can you introduce me to somebody in your organization who's responsible for this kind of function?" That's one aspect of it. The other thing on LinkedIn is to join groups.

Lauren: Exactly.

Gary: Join groups and get involved in the conversation because the input you have will get people reaching out, saying, "Maybe we need to get together."
Looking at the biggest challenges to finding a job, as Lauren said, discouragement can have a major impact on your ability to find work because it affects your mental and emotional states. Your mental and emotional states impact your physiology.

They show up as an expression of your body language. No one wants to hire someone who has low self-confidence and communicates it both verbally and non-verbally. A number of weeks ago, I was on another radio show, and we had a caller who was employed, but he was going into his annual review, which is almost like going into a job interview in some respects.

He was nervous about it, and he asked me for some suggestions, and I told him four things. The first thing is to pray. Rely upon God. God will, through the Holy Spirit, calm your nerves and give you direction.

He'll help you stay focused. Number two is breathe. Take some deep breaths. Sit back. Relax. The person on the other side of the table is a human being who puts his pants on the same way you do every day. Make sure you see yourself as a calm, confident person.

And if you're a person who has some struggles with public speaking or something like that, take the time to practice. Get in front of the mirror and talk to yourself about the things you want to say in a potential interview. Those things are really important. And then we also talked about LinkedIn as being a powerful tool.

It has some great search capabilities for what I term as targeted marketing. So you can look at things from a geographic point of view. Is there a specific area of the country where you would like to work? You can look at specific companies. You can find employees who work for those companies. And as we said in the segment, even if you may not be able to find the owner of the company or a hiring manager,

If you can reach out to one or two employees and say, "Hey, I'd like an introduction to the head of this department," oftentimes they'll respond very positively. Become a member of small business groups on LinkedIn and give your input.

If you can begin to establish yourself as a subject matter expert, or even just letting people know on the business group chat rooms that you're looking for a position and what you're looking for and what you have to offer, and it's not just about what you do, but what you're interested in, that becomes important as well.

You can look at what you've been currently doing in your life, but what other passions do you have? What other things might you be able to do with the skill sets that you have? And so open up your creative thinking in that way. The next thing we wanted to talk about with Lauren is the whole concept of recareering.

Perhaps you've been looking for work and you can't find something in your field, or maybe you're employed and you just don't enjoy what you're doing anymore. Let's hear what Lauren has to say about changing careers. What about those people who are not only unemployed but maybe they've been looking for a period of time and they can't find anything in their field?

They're at a point where it's, "Even if I have to go bag groceries at Walmart, I have to have a job." What kind of advice do you have for people like that? How do you go about deciding what other kinds of jobs you should be looking for?

Lauren: If you're at that point, the best advice that I can give is to ask yourself a series of questions. Self-reflect first, see what really interests you, what you have the ability to be passionate about, then ask yourself questions. Is this a good time to make a change? If you have a family that you need to talk to, can I afford to make this change?

Find someone who can help you, who's in that industry, and let you know how to break into it. Another huge question to ask at that point is, are you willing to start from the bottom and work your way up? That's going to be a process, a huge deciding factor.

Gary: So how do companies respond to those sorts of things, though? Because as an example, if you were a vice president of a company in one job, and now you're looking at going to another company, a totally different position, and you're going to go in as a worker bee and be forced to start at the bottom and work your way up, how do you sell yourself to a company in that respect?

Because I've talked to a lot of other hiring managers, and a lot of attitudes seem to be prevalent as well. "Yeah, the guy will come to work for me, and I'm sure that at this lower level, he'll do a really good job. But as soon as the economy improves and there's a need for him elsewhere for the skills that he has that are so far beyond what he's doing, he's going to bail and leave me. So why would I want to hire him?"

Lauren: I've run into that. The best thing that you can do to show that you're willing to stick it out is maybe education. How much time have you spent getting to learn this career and get into that career? So if you're willing to take the time to maybe go back to school for a master's, go back to school for a college degree, or even just getting a certificate,

There are a lot of opportunities out there to take courses to learn more about what you're looking to do. They'll see the investment in either time or money spent to get to know that industry. You will have to do the hard work to work your way up and improve yourself.

But I think where it makes a difference with HR managers is if you have put investment of either your time or money into learning that new career, I think that they appreciate that, and there always will be that concern that you're going into it saying, "Okay, I might have 20 years of experience doing manufacturing, and now I want to switch and be in sales."

Take some of your previous experience, and you might not realize that some of the manufacturing work you were doing, talking to other people who are employed, there could have been sales, and you weren't even realizing it. Show them that maybe some of those skill sets are embedded, and you really are what you want to do.

Gary: Excellent point. I want to focus on one of the things that Lauren talked about, and that is looking at the skill sets that you have and the whole concept of self-reflection. What I recommend to people I coach is that you do a personal inventory and ask yourself some basic questions like, "What are the core skills that you have that have enabled you to be successful in the past?"

Take the time, make a list of those things, because if you really stop and think about it, there's a lot going on in your life that you don't think about until you sit down and go through it. Then think about what other skills you have that can be used to move you in a different direction, maybe into a different career.

As an example, you may not currently be in a supervisory position, but if you've been involved in leadership in local civic organizations or your church, if you're a troop leader in the Boy Scouts or Girl Scouts, if you've coached baseball, what skill sets do you have that you've developed over the years that you can use?

What are you really passionate about? If you could be king or queen for a day, what kind of job or career would you create for yourself and why? And then as you've put those things together and you begin to think about, "Here's the skill sets I have, and here's some of the things I'm interested in," take the time to do a gap analysis.

Look at the gaps between where you are and where you want to be, and how can you get creative in filling them? Everybody can go back to school and pay money to take courses, but what about going to your local library? What about online resources that are free? What about inexpensive books from Amazon and Barnes and Noble that will help you build your skill set?

Think about those things. We're going to talk now about other sources for finding jobs. We talked about using social media like LinkedIn as one vehicle for finding potential jobs, but what else should you be doing to uncover jobs that no one else knows about? Let's get back to our conversation with Lauren White.

We started the conversation about LinkedIn and using social media like LinkedIn to connect with other people. What are some of the other avenues to find jobs? You hear the statistic that 60, 70, sometimes as high as 80 percent of the jobs that are available never find their way into the newspaper or into things like CareerBuilder or Monster or anything like that.

How do you go about doing that? What are the sources out there to find the jobs that maybe people aren't even paying any attention to?

Lauren: Take your personal network first—those family, friends, people that you talk to on a day-in, day-out basis, and the companies that they work for.
And just do the ask. A lot of people don't take the time to say, "Hey, where do you work? Are there any opportunities at your company?"

I know that, for instance, my father works for General Motors, and he's been there for 30 years, and his experience when I came out of school was huge. No, I didn't want to necessarily work at General Motors.

I didn't want to work at a dealership, but he has a network of marketing communities that company works with and was able to link me up with a marketing community. And then from there, once I'm able to maybe have a phone conversation with that marketing community, they even know people. So extend your branch from the people that you know.

And then my second piece of advice would be community outreach events, like the Chamber of Commerce. Those are great events to go to if you're looking for a job. Those are networkers and people that are out there to help other businesses and to help other individuals. So that would be a huge opportunity to find something just outside of LinkedIn.

Even Facebook, other social media avenues—post things that you're interested in. We're in an online market these days, and just getting the word out there of jobs you're looking for. You'd be amazed at how many people are in your network that you might not think would be advantageous to your growth and really are.

Gary: So basically, when it comes to those sorts of things, assume nothing. Assume everybody out there has something that they can help you with or something you can learn from them. The whole concept of "assume nothing," I think, is really important. Leave no stone unturned.

Use social media to your advantage. Start discussions. Let people know what you're interested in. A lot of people create accounts on LinkedIn and Facebook and then let them die. They don't let anybody know that they're there. They don't start discussions.

They don't participate in discussions. And the more you're out there, not only the more visibility you have to other people, but the more people get to know you. And that's really important. Lauren highlighted your personal network—your family, your friends, your church affiliations, your bowling, golfing, fishing buddies.

The main thing is don't be afraid to ask. A lot of times what happens is that we're ashamed that we are unemployed, and it's not our fault. It was just the economy that caused the problem. But there's no shame in being out there looking for a job. Take advantage of the fact that people know other people, and if they can't help you, ask them, "Do you have any other connections?

Do you know any other business owners or people who have influence in certain areas of business where I might be able to make a connection?" Think about other networks. There are a number of business networking groups right here in Connecticut who meet at least once a month, sometimes more often than that.

Go, take the time to meet new people, find out what they do, share what you're interested in, and ask what their company's needs are and if they have any other connections you might speak with. Even if they're not aware of a need in their business, ask them for the contact information of one of the decision-makers in their company.

You would be absolutely surprised at how often people will create a position for someone who is tenacious and persistent enough to reach out to them. And also think about business associations. As an example, if you're a manufacturing engineer, are you a member of SME, the Society of Manufacturing Engineers?

Are you using the networking resources that they afford to look for positions, either to find companies, make connections with other people, or some of the organizations actually, in their monthly newsletters and publications, will post positions that are available, so you might be able to find something that way, too.

The next thing we want to talk about is getting people to meet with you. So far, we've talked about having the right kind of attitude and not getting discouraged in your job search. We've talked about some avenues available to help you uncover opportunities—open positions that you can go after.

But how do you go about getting that first interview? And what tools and approaches can you use, especially when you're cold-calling a business? Let's see what Lauren has to say about that.

Certainly, if you're doing the networking thing, whether it's on LinkedIn or through the Chamber of Commerce or whatever, you have the opportunity to talk to people and say, "Hey, who do you know? Or do you know anybody in this particular company? Because it looks like they might have a need for some of the stuff that I do.

Would you be willing to make an introduction? Or can you give me a name and a phone number?" But if you want to work for a particular company or you're interested in talking to them and you haven't found anybody in your network who can make the introduction, how do you go about getting past that—
the HR generalist at the front door? How do you go about finding out who to talk to who might be a hiring manager, somebody who's a decision-maker in the business?

Lauren: Right. A couple of things: be unique and different. A lot of people are following up these days just by sending an email. Tell the person via letter, "Thank you, and I appreciate your time," even if it is the HR generalist, and then give a phone call. I'd say follow-up is the biggest thing when it comes to actually getting in front of the people that you want to get in front of.

Gary: Being consistent.

Lauren: Being persistently consistent and then making those phone calls and making sure that LinkedIn can be another great avenue for that, too—seeing who it is that you need to talk to and then talking to different people at maybe the managerial level or HR generalist level and saying, "Is there any chance that you'd be willing to introduce me to such and such?"

If there's no opportunity for that, then send them edible arrangements. Get creative. Do things that other people out there aren't doing, just to say, "I'm very grateful for this opportunity. I want to pursue this opportunity, and I'm willing to go above and beyond to get to the next stage."

Gary: Now the keys here are, as we talked about, being persistently consistent. Don't give up. Don't be a pest, but keep yourself out there, and if people see that you're persistent, that you continue to reach out to them on a regular basis, sometimes that has a positive impact.

As Lauren said, find the people you want to talk to through searching their businesses on LinkedIn. Even if you don't find a decision-maker there that you're looking for, you may find a company employee who will make an introduction or at least give you some contact information. Take the time to call the company.

A lot of times, receptionists are very open to sharing information. If you're an engineer and you want the engineering manager's name, if you call and say, "Hey, who's the engineering manager in your business?" you can get a name, sometimes a phone number, sometimes an email address that you can reach directly out to that particular person.

Learn to be creative in your phone calls, in your emails, in your letters. And I guess the key thing that I would ask you to think about is that your approach to any potential employer is not about what they can do for you. It's about what you can do for them. Employers want people who are interested in adding value to their companies.

They're not interested in people who want to collect a paycheck. Let's move to a different discussion and talk about one of the great marketing tools for your job search: your resume. We want to talk about the impact of your resume because your resume is one of the main tools in your arsenal for looking for a job.

Each one of us has to be very clear about the purpose of your resume. It is, plain and simple, a marketing tool designed to introduce you to a potential employer. In all of my years in business, I have never once seen any employer look at a resume and tell Human Resources to hire a person.

So the purpose of your resume is to get your toe in the door and to create an initial impression that brings the Human Resources person or the hiring manager to the very rapid conclusion that they want to talk to you. Lauren's got some great input on the impact of your resume on finding a job.

And one of the things that I have talked about in the past—I've taught some resume-writing classes—the message that I've always tried to send to people is that your resume does nothing but get you in the door. And that's what you want it to do. You want it to be a door-opener. So what are some of the key things, maybe some mistakes that you've seen in resumes that you've looked at over the years, and the general approach that you take to how should a resume be structured?

What kind of a message does it need to communicate so that when you're applying for a job along with 200 other people, your resume finds its way to the top of the pile and creates that impression that says, "Man, I really got to talk to this person"?

Lauren: Exactly. I'm actually really glad that you brought this up because, as a recruiter, that is the most interesting thing that I find—that people tend to leave out different things that are so important.

And those things—let me start with the don'ts. Why don't we start there? So the don'ts would be: don't leave gaps in your resume. If you think it might not be relevant experience, it's better to have that experience listed on your resume as opposed to leaving it out. If you've got 30 years, don't include information that's going to be three pages long.

Like you said, you only have a few minutes to look over people's resumes. So make sure that it's very focused, that there's the last 10 years of experience listed on your resume. It can go a couple of pages if you've been in the industry over 10 years, but if you haven't, it better be one page. Make sure that you are editing it.

A lot of don'ts would be to leave mistakes in there that aren't proofread, that are run-on sentences, that don't make any sense when you take a quick glance, because that is all that they have to work off of. Another one that I could think of is: do have quantitative data. A lot of people tend to leave out— they put their job responsibilities, but they tend to leave out how they've made the company better by listing your sales goals that you met or how you increased company culture and in what ways. Quantify that, write that on your resume, and then always put what you're most proud of at the top of your resume.

So if your education was 20-30 years ago and you've worked for some incredible companies after that, why would you put the education at the top? Have those companies and job titles you're most proud of up top. If you went back to school and education is something you want to highlight, put that at the very top.

Gary: Okay, excellent. Just to complement that a little bit, I don't think a lot of people realize how the resume-sorting process goes. Back in the days when I was a hiring manager, I might have an ad in the newspaper for an engineer, and I'd get 200 resumes.

I would take those 200 resumes home, sit in my easy chair in front of the television at night, and in a period of 45 minutes, whittle those resumes down to 10 people that I wanted to talk to. A lot of it is exactly what you're saying. The resume isn't structured properly.

There's no quantitative data. There are misspellings. There are run-on sentences. And my basic attitude is, if you don't care enough to take the time to present me with a well-structured, nice, clean, readable, impressive resume, how do I have any confidence that if I ever hired you, you'd do a good job for me?

Absolutely. So I think it's really important that the resume be polished and be really good. And in some cases, if you don't have those skills, it may be worthwhile to go out and spend $100 or $150 and get a professional resume writer to take it and do something with it and really give you a good marketable piece of material, because that's really what it is.
It's a marketing tool for you personally.

Lauren: Exactly. And even if you say you don't have the money to do that, recruiters at staffing firms will help you with that. Just ask them. Say, "I know that you look at resumes every day. What can I do to make this resume look a little bit more clean, a little bit more sharp?" and they'll be more than happy to assist you.

They also want to get you back in the job market.

Gary: So you can get it for free. Get this free advice from people who look at resumes all the time.

Lauren: There are ways to do that. Absolutely.

Gary: Your resume is really important as a marketing tool, and just to recap some of the things that we talked about, keys to a good resume: keep it focused.

It needs to be neatly done. It's got to have a good visual structure to it. For every company I worked for, I would put the employer, my title, the employment dates, a brief description of what the company did, a brief description of my duties, but the majority of what I was doing was listing my accomplishments and putting things down in as many hard numbers as I could give them.

So if I took on-time delivery from 50 percent to 97 percent in a period of nine months, I said that. Those sorts of things are really important. Make sure people read your resume and give you feedback because you don't want any misspellings or run-on sentences. Make sure you highlight your strengths and your accomplishments.

And a max of two pages unless you're applying for a position either in medicine or academia where they want a lot more detail. But basically, take the approach that your resume wants to answer five questions.

Number one, you want to tell people who you are and how they can contact you.

Number two, you want them to know what you do and what you've accomplished.

Number three, they want a statement that tells them what makes you stand out from everyone else in your field. They want to know what benefits they're going to get if they hire you. And they want to know what next step you want them to take.

And that usually gets covered in a cover letter that you send where you can tell them exactly what you want and what next steps you would like if they're open to doing that. So far in the show, we've talked about the foundation.

We gave you some economic and unemployment and employer perspectives on things, and we talked about that there is a positive side, and there are jobs out there if you know how to find them.

We talked about the biggest challenges to finding a job, the whole idea of being discouraged, and how we need to address those things. No one wants to hire a negative, discouraged person.

So use the power of prayer. Breathe and relax. Be calm and confident and practice things before you go into an interview. Think about the kinds of questions that they're going to ask you. Read through your resume and say, "If I was the person sitting on the other side of the table, what kind of questions would I ask me?"

And be prepared for the difficult questions that people are going to ask you in an interview about the things that you've done in your career.

We talked about recareering and a focus on a personal inventory, the core skills that you have, skills that you may not even have thought about, things that you're really passionate about, and where are the gaps between where you are and where you want to be, and how can you get creative in filling those gaps.

We talked about other sources for finding jobs—using social media, LinkedIn, Facebook, Twitter, using your personal network, business and employment networking events. Job fairs are something that are potentially valuable, not just from the standpoint that you may find an employer there who has a job you might be interested in, but for the networking capabilities that you have, because there's going to be other people there who are just like you.

They're looking for work. Start conversations with them, find out what they're doing. Maybe go out and have a cup of coffee with a couple of them and say, "What are you guys doing, and what kind of success are you seeing? What things seem to be working for you? What things seem to not be working for you?"

We talked about reaching out, becoming members of professional associations. Then we talked about how to actually go about getting meetings—being persistently consistent, not giving up, finding people you want to talk to, calling companies directly, being creative in your phone calls, your emails, and letters, and remembering it's not about what they're going to do for you, it's about what you can do for them.

And then we talked about the impact of your resumes—that it's a marketing tool to get your foot in the door. It needs to be clean, organized, visually appealing, with no misspellings or run-on sentences, and it focuses on your accomplishments.

We want to jump quickly to a couple of other topics here. The first is do's and don'ts for job interviews. So you've finally gotten your foot in the door, and you're now either sitting in an interview room with HR or maybe meeting with your next potential boss. What are the things that you should do and not do?

Let's get back to our conversation with Lauren White. Let's talk a little bit about selling yourself. When you finally get to a point where you have an opportunity to meet with the company, and you're actually sitting with the hiring managers or someone who's going to have a major influence on your ability to get that job, how do you want to approach it? What are the things that you want to say? What are some of the things you absolutely don't want to say?

Lauren: Absolutely. Things you do want to say are asking questions about the company. A lot of people don't take the time to prepare once they do get the opportunity to sit down with someone in person.

So having three questions after looking over their website or the job description that you've come prepared with to ask them, that's huge. Make sure that you have that ready to go. Stuff that is not good to do once you get the opportunity to sit down and showcase your abilities is be negative.

That was one of the biggest turnoffs when I was interviewing individuals—them leaving a job and only having negative things to say about the previous job they did or the previous boss they worked for. I mean, this is about bettering yourself and how you can be positive going to the next stage.

So focus on turning those negatives and making those lemons into lemonade. That will best showcase you and showcase that when you are then put into a company, you're going to be there and be encouraging and be someone that people want to be teammates with and people want to work around and for.

Gary: How do you feel about when you've come to the end of an interview? Sometimes there's that awkward moment where the person you're talking with hasn't really said anything. Is it appropriate for you to say, "Listen, based on what we've talked about, I really like the feel of this opportunity.

I like the people I've met with here today. When can we get together again? I'd really like to have another interview. I'd like to get a chance to see your operation. If you're looking for a supervisory position, I'd like to get a chance to maybe talk with some of the people that I might be working for."

Is it appropriate to ask for those kinds of things and put yourself out there and let the company know you're really interested?

Lauren: Extremely appropriate. Always leave them with a to-do item, whether it's sitting down for an interview or an email. "When will be a great time for me to follow up?

I'm truly interested in this opportunity." Give them the ability to tell you. If they are screening through a lot of other candidates, then say, "I understand there's a lot of other candidates out there, but I would love to take this to the next level. When would you like me to give you a follow-up call?"

Little things like that will stand out and will leave it as an action item, and you'll know how to follow up at that point.

Gary: Okay, and a follow-up to that: after the interview's over and you've gone home, is it appropriate to send a thank-you note to the people you've met with, and if you do, should it be something that's handwritten, or are emails okay?

Lauren: Either way—I mean, it does depend on the job, but I always handwrite. I think that handwritten notes and an email—do both. The more, the merrier in that scenario.

If the person that interviewed you gets an email immediately following, saying so much, that is critical. Then a few days later, when they might have even forgotten about you, gets a letter that says the same thing—that just brings you right back up on the radar. So I would do both.

Gary: Great advice there from Lauren about the do's and don'ts for job interviews. Let's talk about that for a minute. Number one, be prepared. Do your homework on the company.

Going in for a particular job and not having questions to ask them, either about the position or the company itself, shows a lack of preparation on your part and a lack of interest, and believe me, potential employers will pick up on that. So take the time.

Do your homework. Be willing to ask questions that are appropriate for the level of business that you're going to be doing with them for the position that you're going to be getting. I think that's really important, and it's very valuable.

If you can sit down and say, "Listen, I've looked, and I've seen your company has been growing at a rate of 5 percent for the past five years, and you're now at $30 million in sales.

What are your plans for taking things to the next level here?" That communicates to somebody that this individual has not only done their homework, but they're really interested in where this company is going, and that begins to create a valuable impression with them that you can be part of the team, that you can be a contributor to that.

Another thing that Lauren highlighted that's extremely important is don't be negative. If you've had some difficult situations that you've had to deal with with past employers, take the time to think through that stuff and be prepared to discuss it, but do it from the standpoint of not saying, "I left my last job because my boss that I worked for was just a complete moron. He had no idea what he was doing."

That may be true, but you can't ever say that in an interviewing situation. Look at the positive sides of things and look at what you have learned and how you can turn that negative into a positive when you're doing the interview.

And as Lauren said, always take the time at the end of an interview to, if you're interested in the job, let them know. Say, "I'd really like to take this discussion to the next level. Are you open to doing that?" That expresses your interest, and then after the interview is over, do take the time to follow up with people.

Send either a handwritten note, a typed letter, or an email—or all of the above. Sometimes, as Lauren was saying, if you get an email immediately following the interview—and I mean within a few hours after the interview is over—and then a couple of days later, you get a handwritten note that says, "Gee, this person is really interested," it also helps keep you in the forefront of the hiring manager's mind when making a decision about either making a job offer or bringing you back in for another interview.

The final thing we want to talk about today with Lauren is the concept of your attitude during the interview.

How do you approach that whole thing, and what's really important when it comes to that? Let's wrap up our discussion with Lauren White. One last topic: let's talk about your overall attitude when you go into an interview. Obviously, we want to be positive and things, but how do you go about projecting the right kind of attitude that shows your level of interest without being over the top?

And lets the person know that you've done your homework, you're interested in knowing more about what they're doing?

Lauren: When it comes to attitude, just be honest and be yourself. Realize that the other person on the other side of the table is
just another person looking to qualify you for the job. Ultimately, they aren't sitting there trying to waste their time and disqualify you.

They want to work with you. Just always be positive. Try to even ask them questions. Build rapport with them. And then, the most important thing I can say is be honest. If you don't have experience doing something, tell them. They're not going to want to hear, "I've never done it before," but "I am willing to learn."

Just be honest. I'd say that's my best piece of advice when it comes to your attitude in an interview. And that goes without saying that you have to come prepared as well. Come prepared with those three questions to ask about the company, about the job, and then be real. Be real.

Gary: Yeah. I think that's an excellent point—being real, being yourself, being honest—because if you're not, it's going to come back to haunt you at some point because people aren't stupid.

A lot of the people you're interviewing with are very intelligent. They can tell by your body language, by what you're saying, that you're not comfortable and that something doesn't feel right. Just be yourself because that's important for you fitting with the company as you go on. One of the things I talk about, too, is that the interview is a two-way street.

Lauren: Exactly.

Gary: But I think a lot of times people take the attitude, especially when you're out of work and looking for a job, they take the attitude of—what my wife, who's from Slovakia, used to say—"Pani pekni prosim, please give me a job," and as a result, it's almost like you're going in hat in hand, begging for something rather than saying, "Listen, I'm a worthwhile individual. I have a lot to offer your company. So it's not just a matter of you interviewing me, I'm interviewing you, too. And I'm going to show that in the quality of the questions that I ask you, so that we both get a sense of: Are my skills an appropriate fit for this job? Is the culture of the company a good fit with who I am as a person?"

Lauren: Yeah, they'll appreciate that. Absolutely. That's huge. And they understand that you're nervous going into it, too. That's something that I left out. Qualify that on the front end. When you're being real and being honest, say, "Hey, look, I'm coming into this a little bit nervous. I really am excited about this job."

And little things like that will take the pressure off of you feeling as nervous and then making sure that you're coming with those questions because the last thing that you want is to get into a job that isn't the best fit for you.

Even if you're at a point where you are just needing anything that comes up, try to remember to not just take anything that comes up because that'll only lead to a path that won't be the best fit for the company or yourself, and you'll be back on the job market. You want to make sure that you are asking them good, solid questions so that you can find something that's a fit for years to come.

Gary: Lauren White, thank you so much for taking the time to be with me today. I really appreciate all of your input—some great stuff.

Lauren: Oh, thank you. It was absolutely my pleasure.

Gary: So that wraps it with our discussion with Lauren White today about finding jobs in a difficult economy. I hope you found that was really beneficial for you. We look forward to having you back with us next week. So take care, God bless, live your life with passion.

We'll see you next week.